Endpoint Hunter/Gatherer

[R3awak3n]

for road, I think 12 is the choice up front.

[donevwil]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

for road, I think 12 is the choice up front.

My initial thinking as well, but 15mm opens up a slew of MTB hubs and wheels in 650b.

[eBAUMANN]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

for road, I think 12 is the choice up front.

12mm should have never happened.

There is no good reason for it.
And dont tell me "because its lighter."
Thats not a good reason.

It's a ploy by the industry to get everyone to buy new sh*t they dont need.

Ill never surrender.

vive le 15mm!

[R3awak3n]

I agree that is DUMB to have another standard. Just dumb. That said, a road bike does not need a 15mm, but still, so dumb to just create a new thing just for the sake of selling more crap.

[donevwil]

There is also the fact that Endpoint (FBM) appear to use Paragon fork ends and the 12mm is much more attractive on a road fork (i.e. smaller) than the 15mm. Again, however, not a decision driver for me.

[eBAUMANN]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

I agree that is DUMB to have another standard. Just dumb. That said, a road bike does not need a 15mm, but still, so dumb to just create a new thing just for the sake of selling more crap.

MTB does not NEED 15...

(insert John Tomac photo here)

ROAD bikes do not NEED TA, period.

NEED is an illusion, maaaaaannn.

15 existed before cx/road moved to disc and guess what? it works fine!
...there is no good reason it should not be used on a road bike.

Again, weight is not a good reason

[R3awak3n]

Originally Posted by eBAUMANN

MTB does not NEED 15...

(insert John Tomac photo here)

ROAD bikes do not NEED TA, period.

NEED is an illusion, maaaaaannn.

15 existed before cx/road moved to disc and guess what? it works fine!
...there is no good reason it should not be used on a road bike.

Again, weight is not a good reason

road bikes don't need disc brakes. oh boy here we go again.

that said TA on a road bike to me is nice, not because of stiffness (because lets be honest, QR on a carbon fork is plenty stiff and totally fine) but it is nice to have the caliper be in a similar spot when putting a wheel back on. A bit harder with QR.

And you are right, MTB don't need 15mm either, maybe DH does.

But yeah, weight is a stupid stupid reason. Want to save weight, don't use discs on a road biek


also donevil is right, the 12mm fork does look much better from what I remember seeing.

[zzy]

Not just that the UCI is standardizing neutral wheel support around 12mm. It's the most sensible option for road bikes, and TAs are the most sensible way to run discs.

[eBAUMANN]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

road bikes don't need disc brakes. oh boy here we go again.

never said that...

Originally Posted by zzy

Not just that the UCI is standardizing neutral wheel support around 12mm.

yea...because the UCI's neutral support standards have an effect on any of us...
they just go with whatever the industry is doing.
and what the industry is doing is more about $$ than anything else.

that said, i am a fan of discs and thru axles...ill just never go along with whatever the "industry standard" is solely because its the standard.
the ability to use the same wheels on 5 of my bikes is far more important to me as the end user.

[Stevemikesteve]

Originally Posted by eBAUMANN

i am tempted to snag one myself.

Me too. Haven't yet. Curious if any potential second batch tweaks are posted anywhere. Or maybe an order at this point is actually batch # 3. Either way they definitely seem to have a good thing going and cool to hear they've been easy to deal with

[ColonelJLloyd]

Shimano made the decision for 12mm on the front. That's why others have done so, including the UCI, I imagine.

Originally Posted by donevwil

The BB height is puzzling to me as well and I ride 180 cranks. It is my primary negative with this machine, but as you mention 5mm is splitting hairs.

I have an otherwise very similar frame that I spec'd with 75mm BB drop and 15x100 front. If I ordered it tomorrow I would probably go with 80-85mm drop and 12x100 front. When I ordered my frame the only dynamo hub I could get easily was 15x100.

Originally Posted by donevwil

I'm new to discs and you bring up a good point, why build a wheelset (or two) that most likely won't be compatible with any other bike I ultimately buy? I assume at this time 15mm is still the choice up front (they offer both a 12mm and 15mm, as well as QR, fork)?

There are so many convertible hub options these days. I don't want to use hubs that aren't. I would like to know Shimano's rationale for not making their hubs convertible.

[donevwil]

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

I have an otherwise very similar frame that I spec'd with 75mm BB drop and 15x100 front. If I ordered it tomorrow I would probably go with 80-85mm drop and 12x100 front. When I ordered my frame the only dynamo hub I could get easily was 15x100.

I so agree, I've never been bitten by a too low BB (even with 180 cranks racing crits), be that me or the BB doesn't really matter. Kind of a casualty of stock geo unfortunately. This is not an ideal time to forward-proof a low buck TA frame purchase.

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

I would like to know Shimano's rationale for not making their hubs convertible.

Buy one, then be force to buy another. I agree again, part of my more deeply seeded issue. That said, are there any low buck convertible hubs (Bitex, etc.)?

[donevwil]

After a few back and forths with Braden at Ride Endpoint I put down the deposit on an XXL in the next run (late Sept delivery). That'll beat my current spot in the Elephant queue by a good half year. Since I have no other disc wheel bike I'll be going 12mm TA in the front, that'll make hub sourcing a fun project.

Now to come to terms with the planned lo-buck drivetrain spec, Campy 10 ergos (have), WI VBC 44-28 crank (have), CX70 front derailleur (have), SRAM GX 10 spd long cage rear (have), 26" Shimano 12mm TA road wheel build (oldpotatoe) and a 12-30 Ultegra 10 cassette.

[CiclistiCliff]

Originally Posted by donevwil

After a few back and forths with Braden at Ride Endpoint I put down the deposit on an XXL in the next run (late Sept delivery). That'll beat my current spot in the Elephant queue by a good half year. Since I have no other disc wheel bike I'll be going 12mm TA in the front, that'll make hub sourcing a fun project.

Now to come to terms with the planned lo-buck drivetrain spec, Campy 10 ergos (have), WI VBC 44-28 crank (have), CX70 front derailleur (have), SRAM GX 10 spd long cage rear (have), 26" Shimano 12mm TA road wheel build (oldpotatoe) and a 12-30 Ultegra 10 cassette.

Sounds like a perfect build, but why 26" wheel?

[donevwil]

Originally Posted by CiclistiCliff

Sounds like a perfect build, but why 26" wheel?

I'm 240# and live in an area with very poor roads so bigger is very much better for the riding I do. Currently riding Compass Snoqualmie 700 x 44s and love them, but can easily see going bigger. Compass Rat Trap Pass 26 x 2.3" are significantly larger than Switchback Hill 650b x 48s yet the same diameter +/- as Babyshoe 42s which will be on my eventual 2nd wheelset and make fender fitment simpler. I already have an awesome 700c bike that fits 38s so this will fill out the big tire range without having to give up on a road Q-factor which my hips will not allow.