"Teaching moment" for my kid last night

[jmoore]

Originally Posted by 2LeftCleats

OP--this place can be exhausting. There is often considerable wisdom and insight, though it can be challenging sorting that from the personal anecdotes, hijacks,and tangential offerings. But you knew that when you posted.

agreed

Originally Posted by 2LeftCleats

I'm not clear of your reason for presenting this interaction between you and your son. If it was for a congratulatory backslap, you should have been prepared for disappointment. Every parent here will have a reaction, ranging from applause to cringing. This could drag on another 10 pages, so bring a sleeping bag.

Maybe I'm not clear on why I posted it either. I am not trying to be deliberately provocative, but this is not the first thread I have posted here that I felt was innocuous that has spiraled off in a direction I would have never expected. Maybe it's in my nature to unknowingly stir things up. I have read, and posted, many similar threads to this on other forums and the reactions are generally very different here than other places.

I should probably stick to bicycle topics from now on.

[Bruce K]

One of my closest friends once told me that your child is one of the most important things that come into your life, and one of the few that doesn't have an owner's manual

We all do the best we can and hope it turns out OK

BK

[redir]

jmoore seems like the kind of guy that has a good sense of humor to me. That's something my father had as well and I can appreciate it. I think he deserves a break now. I also think that it's quite possible that a lot of the criticism that he is getting says more about the criticizer then anything else

That's they way message board / forums are though whether they are about bikes, cars, tools, kittens, sewing, kite flying, sailing...

[pdmtong]

Originally Posted by jmoore

this place is exhausting sometimes

Originally Posted by jmoore

Maybe it's in my nature to unknowingly stir things up. I have read, and posted, many similar threads to this on other forums and the reactions are generally very different here than other places.

I should probably stick to bicycle topics from now on.

Your thread offered a range of articulated opinions. The perspectives which differed from yours were presented civilly.

If you indeed find it exhausting, then yes, stick to bicycle topics from now on.

I purposely read the threads and opinions that disagree with my own thought because I believe having my opinions challenged is a good thing. Reinforcement may shed insight on augmenting my approach. Contrary thought is an opportunity to look beyond my view and be reminded the world is not like me.

When discussed with candor and grace, these threads are what makes this place far more valuable to me than simply a bike forum

[Scuzzer]

Originally Posted by pdmtong

Your thread offered a range of articulated opinions. The perspectives which differed from yours were presented civilly.

Discussing parenting issues is hard. There are at least as many opinions as there are participants and there is no way in the short term to tell who is right. In my experience it almost always ends up with tension or feelings being hurt so I've stopped participating in them with my neighbors. IMO it's easier to discuss politics or religion.

[pdmtong]

Originally Posted by Scuzzer

Discussing parenting issues is hard. There are at least as many opinions as there are participants and there is no way in the short term to tell who is right. In my experience it almost always ends up with tension or feelings being hurt so I've stopped participating in them with my neighbors. IMO it's easier to discuss politics or religion.

When it comes to parenting topics the end goal isn't to declare a victor or to amass a for-against tally. Rather, I think each of us would hope for a collection of diverse and thoughtfully written opinions.

If a mutual admiration society is wanted, this forum isn't the place.

As you noted "there are at least as many opinions as there are participants". If someone disagrees with me, I'd like to hear their view - bikes - life - whatever.

The time to stop participating is when folks take constructive conversation personally. You can't inform someone who doesn't want to be informed. (note: this is not a veiled comment on the OP)

[Scuzzer]

Originally Posted by pdmtong

If someone disagrees with me, I'd like to hear their view - bikes - life - whatever.

I agree 100% but when dealing face to face with people I've found that it's impossible to discuss parenting without someone coming away with the thought that you've just told them they're total morons. My wife and I interact with around a half dozen couples in the neighborhood who have children in the same age range as ours and the parenting styles run the gamut from disciplinarian to "I never want to see my kid unhappy". Odds are pretty good that all of our kids are going to do just fine in life despite the differences in parenting styles. Nobody is keeping a scorecard of winners and losers here.

Bringing it back to the original topic, I might have tried what the OP did with my son but it would have been useless with my daughter. Therefore, I'm totally agnostic as to the parenting morality of his actions.

[gasman]

We all do the best we can as parents. Each kid is different and what works for one may not work with the next. My kids have turned out great but we had to use very different styles with each of them. I think it's hard to criticize the OP since none of us was there and don't know the father or son.

My wife and I came to an agreement after the first several years-the first one in rule. The parent that dealt with any situation where the other parent wasn't present always got the benefit of the doubt. I feel the same here. The OP was the first in and handled it how he felt was appropriate.

[mosca]

Ah, the George Bluth Sr. school of parenting.

[TMB]

Originally Posted by jmoore

agreed





Maybe I'm not clear on why I posted it either. I am not trying to be deliberately provocative, but this is not the first thread I have posted here that I felt was innocuous that has spiraled off in a direction I would have never expected. Maybe it's in my nature to unknowingly stir things up. I have read, and posted, many similar threads to this on other forums and the reactions are generally very different here than other places.

I should probably stick to bicycle topics from now on.

Bigman,

Yep. I read the OP and left it at that.

Father and son. Happens all the time.

How it degenerated from there into comments and criticism of your parenting choices is just flat out beyond me.

Too many people, too much time.

Go play catch with the boy.

[ORMojo]

Originally Posted by TMB

How it degenerated from there into comments and criticism of your parenting choices is just flat out beyond me.

Too many people, too much time.

My feelings about the content of the original post are way too intense to comment on that...

But this response makes no sense to me. This is an Internet forum, obviously the OP knows that. The entire intent of such a forum is for the airing/sharing of comments, which may include critical comments. Why would that be beyond you?

"Too many people, too much time"...again, this is an Internet forum. People choose to spend their time here. Why would you criticize that? You spent the time to read the thread and post a reply, in part criticizing others doing exactly the same (irrespective of content, because you really don't want to go down that path).

So, in summary, this thread is playing out exactly as it should given the venue.

[tumbler]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

You never know what experiences are going to be formative.

This really is the heart of it. I'm sure that many of the lessons my dad gave me fell on deaf (or at least forgetful) ears, but others have stuck with me to this day. I think it was a good lesson and hopefully one of the ones that will stick.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Bruce K

One of my closest friends once told me that your child is one of the most important things that come into your life, and one of the few that doesn't have an owner's manual

We all do the best we can and hope it turns out OK

BK

I would say the most important thing, period. And hardest job there is, period. Once again, the original post, I think he did well.

"All will be ok in the end.
If it's not OK, it's not the end".

I think he did fine and some take a few sentences and analyze the beejesus out of it, and then the scrum starts. A $5 statement with a $1000 analysis

Oh well.......

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

I think he did fine and some take a few sentences and analyze the beejesus out of it, and then the scrum starts. A $5 statement with a $1000 analysis

No. This is not even remotely correct. The statement would be correct if it was said that somebody "read the statement and knew it was wrong". Or in this case disagreed with it because there are no absolutes in the craft of parenting.

As a pilot, you did not see something your gauges or indicator warnings told you and then have to ponder it (analyze the bejesus out of it). You knew.

This is a cheap shot in being dismissive to a point of view you don't agree with. Nobody here is trying to make a mountain outta a molehill.

[Ray]

Adrian Peterson could probably post here about whipping his 4 year old son with the branch of a tree, many would raise objections, and some would chastise them/us for raising objections. Take this discussion back 20-30 years and a lot more would defend that action than today.

And, NO, I'm NOT equating the two! I'm just making a point.

If you're gonna post about child rearing techniques publicly, some are gonna find things to object to based on their own experiences with similar techniques. Many of us have raised or are raising children. ALL of us have been children. What the OP did was not unique. Some think it's fine, some think it's not at all fine. I made the point that it might be OK for his kid or he may find out later it wasn't. And that in my case, it absolutely wouldn't have been. Perhaps that perspective, borne of experience, will be useful to some here. Perhaps not. Pretty much as with the OP's story.

I consider my "analysis" worth the same $5 as the original post - where does "$1000 analysis" come from? It's just a different point of view and there's not a damn thing wrong with expressing it if someone's gonna bring the topic up in the first place.

-Ray