OT: VW cheating emissions on TDI vehicles

[fuzzalow]

Originally Posted by palincss

But I do wonder about your "occasional <60 mph burst on the Beltway" - maybe where you are on the Great Circle (Georgia Ave?) things go that slow, but where I am you'd better be doing over 70 if you want to ride in the left lane, and heading south from the Beltway on Rt 4 or Rt 5 you could add another 5-10 mph to that.

I meant no disrespect towards your local roadways. I regularly take the shuttle between LAG-DCA and I like D.C. (But as a friend says, "that's because you never leave NW").

I've only experienced driving the Beltway portion only between I95 and Wisconsin. As driver and grunt labor in Dad's Moving Company as it were in temporarily relocating my offspring to University in NW. I don't now miss doing that drive and I don't now miss paying those bills!

[David Kirk]

Not that any of you are waiting with bated breath wondering what I'm going to do with my TDi....but.......I'm going to wait until spring to do anything. Winter is the only time of year that Karin works outside the house and needs the car to get to/from work and the supply of new cars here to replace our TDi is slim on the ground. And since we can't do without we will wait.

If they announce a real fix over the winter we might take it and use the money to redo the bathroom, if not we'll turn it in and buy something else.

So the waiting continues.

dave

[ptourkin]

Got my offer package today. I uploaded my docs when that part went live.

[Cat3roadracer]

Originally Posted by ptourkin

Got my offer package today. I uploaded my docs when that part went live.

And is it what you expected?

[tv_vt]

Anybody know the last year you could get a JSW with MT in anything other than basic S model, if ever? And did those models all come with the 2.5L 5 cyl engine, not the newer 4cyl?

[ptourkin]

Originally Posted by Cat3roadracer

And is it what you expected?

Yes. It is the same amount that I calculated on the site. So far, my dealer has offered to notarize the documents but beyond that, I haven't been offered any incentives.

[shovelhd]

Originally Posted by tv_vt

Anybody know the last year you could get a JSW with MT in anything other than basic S model, if ever? And did those models all come with the 2.5L 5 cyl engine, not the newer 4cyl?

2014 was the last year of the JSW, available with DSG or 6MT in TDI trim, 5MT or 6 speed slush with the 2.5l. S only. Some of the earlier MKVI JSW's could be had in SE trim with the gasser.

[dawgie]

So, TDI owners, would you buy another VW? I have a 2012 Golf 2.5 with manual transmission and love this car. It has good pickup for a small car, handles great and has been reliable. Unfortunately, it is not the car I wanted or need at present. When I bought it 4 years ago, I wanted a Jetta Sportwagen TDI but my dealer had none in stock with manual transmissions and VW was offering great deals on the Golf 2.5.

I still find myself wanting a Sportwagen due to its larger storage capacity, 4 doors and overall utility. Although the TDI is no longer an option, VW seems to be offering some decent incentive packages on new cars. However, I feel that VW really screwed its customers with the whole TDI scandal, as well as the very real environmental and legal consequences of its actions. Nevertheless, I still haven't found a new car that I like better than the Sportwagen in terms of overall utility, looks and handling. Gas mileage could be better but it's not as bad as most SUVs.

[palincss]

Originally Posted by dawgie

So, TDI owners, would you buy another VW?

Short answer, yes. The list of wagons on the market (not SUVs) that will fit a bicycle in my size with full metal fenders is pretty small these days, and all the non-VW ones are anywhere from $25,000 - $40,000 more.

[shovelhd]

I'm looking primarily at used 2011-2016 GTI's and 2014-2015 Mazda 3 S GT's. Both have less cargo capacity than the JSW but I can survive without it. Both will tow my small trailer. Both have reliability issues.

[carpediemracing]

Originally Posted by dawgie

So, TDI owners, would you buy another VW

No. I've posted this before but since the thread is a bazillion pages long...

I've been disappointed with the little things that keep going wrong with the two TDIs we own. Yes, they're fun to drive. For me they are not "just change the oil and drive" kind of cars.

One thing I did was compare extended warranty costs on comparable cars. GTI, Mazdaspeed3, Civic Si, same year (2013 I think), similar miles (35k or so).
- MS3, about $1800 for 5 years, 150k odometer
- Civic Si, about the same, $1800 or so.
- GTI, $5100.

$5100?!

And they wouldn't warranty the GTI to 150k odometer miles, they'd only warranty to 125k miles.

This is telling me that actuaries in some insurance company did some studies and figured out that it costs almost 3x as much in non-maintenance, non-wear parts/service to keep the GTI on the road as long as a Mazdaspeed3 or a Civic Si. Under the extended warranty the deal is that wear parts aren't covered and maintenance isn't covered.

This means that beyond regular wear items and regular maintenance a typical GTI owner might expect to spend, say, $4k (giving a $1k margin on the extended warranty?) on unexpected, unscheduled, broken/failed/defective parts.

I can do some stuff on cars (in the last 8? years I've done brakes, struts, exhaust, misc parts) but I'd rather not. I don't have easy access to a lift anymore. Etc.

My brother, who has a 2010? Civic Si with 180+k miles on it, was putting gas in his car. GTI next to him. Asked the guy how he liked the car. "It's great when it's running."

[jc031699]

Just scheduled my buyback appt. They only show 2 slots per week until end of February, at 10 and 11 am on Thursdays. Nothing from March on. I have to take half day off work for a 30 minute buyback appt?? What a load of BS. This is bad faith if I've ever seen it.

I ended up having to schedule into February because of existing work commitments.

The only other two dealerships within 100 miles have the same limited appts, only at 10 and 11 AM on Tuesdays instead of Thursdays. Convenience and choice sure don't seem to be a priority for them.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by dawgie

So, TDI owners, would you buy another VW? I have a 2012 Golf 2.5 with manual transmission and love this car. It has good pickup for a small car, handles great and has been reliable. Unfortunately, it is not the car I wanted or need at present. When I bought it 4 years ago, I wanted a Jetta Sportwagen TDI but my dealer had none in stock with manual transmissions and VW was offering great deals on the Golf 2.5.

I still find myself wanting a Sportwagen due to its larger storage capacity, 4 doors and overall utility. Although the TDI is no longer an option, VW seems to be offering some decent incentive packages on new cars. However, I feel that VW really screwed its customers with the whole TDI scandal, as well as the very real environmental and legal consequences of its actions. Nevertheless, I still haven't found a new car that I like better than the Sportwagen in terms of overall utility, looks and handling. Gas mileage could be better but it's not as bad as most SUVs.

I would. My TDI JSW is perfect. Comfy, easy to drive, perfect for hauling around 2 grand daughters and their junk. Great mileage, reliable, quick...I just don't get all sweated up, philisophically. They screwed the pooch but I still like the car, it's a car, after-all..not peace in the middle east. Not like GM, or Tanaka, which killed/maimed. AND when I see a redneck roll coal or an 18 wheeler belching black going up the hill outta the republic..well..

Other 'wagon's out there? For the $?..nope, not new. Don't want to do 2 things..buy a used car or have a car payment(paid cash for the JSW).

VW got caught, is making it right, IMHO. I'm probably getting a new, 2017 GSW gasser..so I drove my TDI for 3 years..then get a new GSW..for no or very little $..

it's a car.

[shovelhd]

There are plenty of Tanaka airbags in VW's, but they just sourced them.

The Mazdaspeed 3 is a performance car, whereas the Mazda 3 is a sporty sedan or hatchback. It's interesting that the warranty companies don't look at it that way. They should. Mazdas tend to have the same kind of niggling issues as VW's. I think the difference is that they don't typically need the expensive repairs, like intake carbon cleaning and timing chain tensioners.

[carpediemracing]

Originally Posted by shovelhd

The Mazdaspeed 3 is a performance car, whereas the Mazda 3 is a sporty sedan or hatchback. It's interesting that the warranty companies don't look at it that way. They should. Mazdas tend to have the same kind of niggling issues as VW's. I think the difference is that they don't typically need the expensive repairs, like intake carbon cleaning and timing chain tensioners.

I specifically got a MS3 VIN number for comparison, not a regular 3. All three cars have somewhat stressed 4 cyl engines, 2 have turbos, all were manuals (no automatic transmissions to throw off the calculations), are somewhat "sporty" (I assume they get beat on harder), etc. The three cars end up at the top of the compact car comparisons so should be reasonable data/history.

Some other data points:
08 Lexus IS F, $2200 (150k, V-8, due to age only 3 years, true automatic meaning no dual clutch business which isn't covered)
11? MS3, $1800 (150k, age limited to 4 years, manual)
13 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec, $1900? (V-8, 5 years, 150k, true automatic).
11? 3 series BMW, $5500-6000 (guy pulled this up as an example so I didn't take notes other than it was the same year as the other compact cars, I think it was an automatic).

The airbag thing was sourced, yes, so I don't really count those issues. Our Golf has a recalled airbag I think. Maybe it's the JSW. One of them. I expect cars to have source problems. I don't think they should design something that causes higher maintenance costs (like the intake manifold sensor that requires replacing the actual manifold, or, with, say, the E46 M3s, the bushing that doesn't do well in hot environments or in oil, and it's an internal engine part).