OT: Acoustic Guitar

[Louis]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

Just learned Mary Had a Little Lamb. I get the feeling it is going to be a LONG process to become proficient. haha

Matt, in a few weeks this will be you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xjJXT0C0X4

[rounder]

There have been a lot of good recommendations about fair - good guitars.

I recommend also comparing to a high end acoustic guitar like a Martin, Taylor or Gibson to see what they are about. If you like high end or custom bikes, there is a good chance you will see the differences in a better guitar. It does not mean that you should buy a high end guitar just because you can see and appreciate the difference.

But, if you try one, you may find the neck more comfortable, it will be easier to get the guitar in tune, you may find that the strings are still in tune when you play higher up on the neck, not just in the lower position. You may find that the tone is much better (new strings can have something to do with that). When you hold it and look at it, you may find that the good guitar just looks better and feels better than the other also guitar.

Price-wise, there is a big difference. A new good guitar may cost $1,500 compared to about $500 for an ok guitar. A good used guitar may cost half that.

I bought a (high-end) Martin D-28 for about $300 in 1970. I later bought a 1995(?) Martin HD-28 (pretty much same guitar) for about $1,500. Today the same guitar is about twice that. My guess is that a comparable Taylor or Gibson would be bout the same price.

My vote is that you play the guitars that are within your price range, but that you also play some of the higher end comparable guitars. If you play them all and can not tell a difference, what difference does it make what you buy. But if you play them all and find that you like the nicer guitars, then you should find a way to get the guitar that really sends you.

[gngroup]

Go to a good music shop with both new and vintage guitars and play! You may gravitate naturally toward one versus another for a variety of reasons (action, tone, etc). Guitars vary so much that I think you are missing a big part of the process if you don't go tool around on them for a few weeks before taking the plunge. I still have my 71' Gibson J45 that I bought 20 years ago as a high schooler - it just had that something that spoke to me. I've had and played others but this one has remained. I found it in a used shop and played about every guitar they had until I settled on that one.

[classtimesailer]

I'm jealous. It may take me 16 years to learn to play my Crafter ( which you might consider if you were considering a Yamaha). When I can finally play, I'm getting a National Resophonic from Doug Macleod.

[MattTuck]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ6iyWSEzIs

[redir]

"The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step."

I've played a few CF instruments and they sounded pretty darn good. You can paddle a canoe with one too, just in case your up a creek without one.

[Avincent52]

I know a thing or two about acoustic guitars, as I'm lucky enough to call some of America's greatest builders my friends. (So this question is a bit like answering the $200 road bike question for some of you....)

1) I'd go out and play a lot of instruments. Find out what a good--or great--guitar sounds like. Find out what size (both body shape and neck shape) works for you ergonomically and meshes well with your style.

2) Realize that you'll get the most out of your modest budget if you buy a used guitar. Learn a little about the issues to look for and how to recognize them. Some should scare you away (high action/low saddle which could mean a neck re-set is necessary)
Others --like back or side cracks--can be fixed pretty easily.

3) Head for the guitar equivalent of Paceline. The Unofficial Martin Guitar Forum and the Acoustic Guitar Forum both have active classified sections much like our classifieds here.
Sellers tend to be quite upfront about the issue a guitar might have and the transactions tend to be much more relaxed than, say, ebay.
You might post a free WTB ad, because for many guitar nuts a $500 guitar might be their camping guitar, or a student guitar they bought for a kid.

If you've got any specific questions, feel free to PM me.

[Louis]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ6iyWSEzIs

Steel is real

-

[benb]

Funny I had responded before even though I have barely touched my Yamaha FG700 in months, largely cause I've done a ton of biking this season.

I pulled it out yesterday, tried to play it sitting, and bam, within 15 minutes my rotator cuff (right side) was starting to ache. I'm going to go start looking for something smaller very soon. I just can't seem to make it work for me.. hurts my shoulder in the "casual position", if I try and hold it in "classical position" it feels like my left hand has to reach a mile away to get to the lower frets, and I have a hard time holding it steady standing. Standing definitely works best but I don't want to stand all the time.

Who knows why it gives me so much trouble.. but I want to be able to play it sitting while I learn so something smaller is in the cards. I think my right shoulder is just right at the edge of it's range of motion to get around the guitar when sitting.

[redir]

Originally Posted by benb

Funny I had responded before even though I have barely touched my Yamaha FG700 in months, largely cause I've done a ton of biking this season.

I pulled it out yesterday, tried to play it sitting, and bam, within 15 minutes my rotator cuff (right side) was starting to ache. I'm going to go start looking for something smaller very soon. I just can't seem to make it work for me.. hurts my shoulder in the "casual position", if I try and hold it in "classical position" it feels like my left hand has to reach a mile away to get to the lower frets, and I have a hard time holding it steady standing. Standing definitely works best but I don't want to stand all the time.

Who knows why it gives me so much trouble.. but I want to be able to play it sitting while I learn so something smaller is in the cards. I think my right shoulder is just right at the edge of it's range of motion to get around the guitar when sitting.

It's not really too uncommon. There are many who have trouble with dreadnought sized guitars and their shoulder. You may want to consider a 12 fret guitar. In the classical position it won't feel like it's miles away and in general is more comfortable to play.

[IJWS]

Originally Posted by Avincent52

I know a thing or two about acoustic guitars, as I'm lucky enough to call some of America's greatest builders my friends. (So this question is a bit like answering the $200 road bike question for some of you....)

1) I'd go out and play a lot of instruments. Find out what a good--or great--guitar sounds like. Find out what size (both body shape and neck shape) works for you ergonomically and meshes well with your style.

2) Realize that you'll get the most out of your modest budget if you buy a used guitar. Learn a little about the issues to look for and how to recognize them. Some should scare you away (high action/low saddle which could mean a neck re-set is necessary)
Others --like back or side cracks--can be fixed pretty easily.

3) Head for the guitar equivalent of Paceline. The Unofficial Martin Guitar Forum and the Acoustic Guitar Forum both have active classified sections much like our classifieds here.
Sellers tend to be quite upfront about the issue a guitar might have and the transactions tend to be much more relaxed than, say, ebay.
You might post a free WTB ad, because for many guitar nuts a $500 guitar might be their camping guitar, or a student guitar they bought for a kid.

If you've got any specific questions, feel free to PM me.

THIS...is good advice.

[benb]

Originally Posted by redir

It's not really too uncommon. There are many who have trouble with dreadnought sized guitars and their shoulder. You may want to consider a 12 fret guitar. In the classical position it won't feel like it's miles away and in general is more comfortable to play.

That was easy.. I went and traded my Yamaha in on an Alvarez that is 00 sized. Played that and a Martin mini dreadnought (D-JR?). Both seemed to be fine, the Martin was just way out of my league price wise. They both seemed WAY smaller on my lap even though the measurements wouldn't make you think they were much smaller. They both had a smaller scale and yet for whatever reason the lower frets are not a reach at all despite being 14 fret. I played the Alvarez till my fingertips were raw before buying it and my shoulder wasn't bothered at all. I'm pretty psyched as the damage wasn't bad, and the Alvarez has pickups too.

[fuzzalow]

I don't have much to add about acoustic guitars but can add a comment appropriate to trying 'n buying them and of guitars in general:

The setup of the guitar makes a lotta difference and IMO it is extremely rare to find a showroom guitar finely setup even disregarding the unique specifics as to individual player preference. Neck relief, string action, nut spacing & height, even frets that are unevenly dressed are things that new guitars don't usually get paid attention to. And this changes the feel and influences the tone. Guitar Center!? Fuhgettaboudit.

The only shop where almost every guitar on the showroom wall was setup pretty well was Mandolin Brothers on Staten Island NYC. Stan Jay ran that shop like his own home where customers could stop by almost like to check out Stan's own guitars. RIP Stan.

Yamahas aren't too bad and a good value last time I looked. Set'em up correctly for how you like 'em makes more difference than the guitar at the price points most people are shopping in. Hey, just like bikes!

[sparky33]

Originally Posted by fuzzalow

The only shop where almost every guitar on the showroom wall was setup pretty well was Mandolin Brothers on Staten Island NYC. Stan Jay ran that shop like his own home where customers could stop by almost like to check out Stan's own guitars. RIP Stan.

Huh? I had no idea.
Mandolin Bros was a regular pilgrimage for me over the years, but it's been a long while. So many very fine instruments just waiting to be played. Bought and sold a couple banjos with Stan. Good guy. RIP.

[redir]

Originally Posted by benb

That was easy.. I went and traded my Yamaha in on an Alvarez that is 00 sized. Played that and a Martin mini dreadnought (D-JR?). Both seemed to be fine, the Martin was just way out of my league price wise. They both seemed WAY smaller on my lap even though the measurements wouldn't make you think they were much smaller. They both had a smaller scale and yet for whatever reason the lower frets are not a reach at all despite being 14 fret. I played the Alvarez till my fingertips were raw before buying it and my shoulder wasn't bothered at all. I'm pretty psyched as the damage wasn't bad, and the Alvarez has pickups too.

Well that was quick!

I spend a fair amount of time over at the Acoustic Guitar forum and am always trying to convince people that buying a guitar sight unseen is often a mistake. Or at least have a good return policy. And that's for all the reasons you mention. Even if you walked into a room with 20 identical guitars, same brand, model, size, scale, shape and so on there would be one there that would just feel right for some reason.